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Post by pzoltan on Aug 13, 2014 1:58:47 GMT -5
Yesterday I read a letter from a recruited Transcarpathian (Kárpátalja, Hungarian territory in "Ukraine") 20 years old Hungarian boy. It was shocking. I mean I follow the news everyday, but my people has nothing to do with this war. The Hungarian gnovement does nothing against these conscriptions. We have nothing do with this war! And in the meantime, the Ukranians settle down their refuges from east on Hungarian territories to change the ethnical rates. Slavic madness! We don't want it!
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Post by John on Aug 14, 2014 12:13:26 GMT -5
the whole world is turning upside down. this is crazy. i wonder if there will end up being a WWIII soon? i also wonder if the way we are all feeling right now is the way the people felt back before WWI and WWII?
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Post by Stas on Aug 15, 2014 2:09:57 GMT -5
The situation is for sure not coming to world war. World majors now press breaks though they wanna get their profit. Idea loks the same- world majors opposing each other.If some peoples still want to buy bead selling their country, world major will make profit. I really like the comment of one American guy on the matter of offer of buying East European apples :
"Thats what You get kissing American^s ass. But You are to do it much more if You want to sell us Your apples. You could invade Russia, may be this would work?" To my mind irony and satire is evident and the matter is clear.
To get out of this the Ukrainian people should come to national dialog.
Zoltan, I hope Your friend will not get to the battlefield and he will come back home alive and well ! Its better to stay apart from this insanity. This is how it looks like every day now-
www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYBbwnBrabI&list=UU0spzGOh1LaVSIiHAkjnZuA
By Kiev suppportes this war often is called not inter-slavic, they often call this a war of Ukrainians with "Russian ugro-finnic mongoloids". How all of this leads them to Europe, its a absurd.
In any time and in any country there are some demented amount of men, but they should not have power and all the country is to be reasonable or it will fall very soon.
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Post by pzoltan on Aug 19, 2014 1:00:09 GMT -5
Thank you!
Well, that's true indeed! Russians the composition of Slavic and Turkic and Finnic peoples, but the Slavs are minority. Especially the Northen part of Russia, those people are literally Russian speaking Finnics there, that's why Russians have a little non-European look. The Russians assimilate those peoples very fast, sadly.
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Post by Stas on Aug 21, 2014 0:32:51 GMT -5
Well, I would definitely mention Germans and Jewishes as big groups in Russia. .. the Northen part of Russia, those people are literally Russian speaking Finnics there, that's why Russians have a little non-European look. The Russians assimilate those peoples very fast, sadly.
One of my relatives is from this region. Once we were taking sauna and he started to tell his story of life. He became an army officer and travelled Russia during his military carrier. Once he saw a beautiful city on Volga river with plenty of churches and woods. It was ancient city of Yaroslavl. He thought that it would be great to settle there. Later he met a girl from this city and married her. Now he has a daughter and 3 grandchilds.
I was born in a muli-ethnic region and we had no collisions there. Every ethnos used its language locally and alltogether they used Russian to comunicate.
State supported original ethnic cultures. Local theatres and papres were widely spreaded even having no real responce from habitants.
The force of Russia is unity and friendship of all the people. WIthout this inity it can not exist.
So word "Russia" has non-ethnic meaning and, to my mind, come from past, meaning "habited land, civilised land". We see this word worldwide.
Rus ( Latin)- country, settled countryside Prussia ( PreuBen) ,Paris ( parisiens), Persia ( persians). We still can find some European legacy - Russilion, Russenborg,Russelheim etc with many sir-names.
During all history there always were attempts to reform Cyrillic ABC into Latin- For instance, this brosure is 1833:
So coming to the topic, the batlle front looks stabile though the coming winter brings catastrophy. Habitants of Ukraine are told to stock woods to have heating.
People in Donetsk in a basement while bombs are falling-
Prisooned Kiev^s soldiers, 2 of thousand-
Heavy armors on both sides-
Heaving lost her husbamd who took part in punishing war, Kiev anti-corruption minister Tatiana Chernovol ( Blackbull) has gone out of politics. She said that she just wanted to do something good.
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Post by monstermanlt on Sept 4, 2014 0:05:34 GMT -5
Hello, I came back to this forum and I can't believe what I see in this topic... As being former citizen of SU, I still remember this nightmare years and I don't know who wants to return to these times. My opinion - all problems probably will be solved till now if not Russian invasion. Some of you said you're watching/reading BBC but it seems like you're watching only Russian propaganda TV channels. Terrorists, nazis etc. I hope you're joking. People who kicked out puppet-president are terrorists or people who want live in normal country? Legal referendum, illegal... What about this picture? Is it normal? http://http://img.rt.com/files/news/23/6b/e0/00/crimea-4.si.jpg I was ill in march and I had a lot of time for TV watching. I watched few Russian channels and I can't remember when I was laughting more than watching TV news. Best example of Russian TV "truth": www.youtube.com/watch?v=fx3QuNca6LUPzoltan, it's 2014 today, not 1400s My country had borders with Black sea in Middle-ages. So what I have to do? Scream: gimme back Belorus, Kaliningrad etc.?
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Post by Stas on Sept 4, 2014 6:18:41 GMT -5
Labas ritas, MonstermanLT.
What I like is an opportunity to exchange opinions.I give my opinion and facts not more. I am not a direct participator but I am in direct touch with people on both sides.
I can not comment Your picture cause I do not see it. As to the video where the same man in the first interview to one TV channel says that he prerared rebellion and in the second interview to another TV channel they say that he is just a victim. By all means as I got from this video is that he is not just a guy from Ukraina- he is a German citizen now. Probably he is activist.
As to me, I do not trust official opinions , I try to rely on facts. The situation take place not far away- its just close by so everyone can get info directly.
So
1. There is no war declared by Ukraina. They also did not declare the martial law in Ukraina.So officially there is no any war or invasion.They declared "anti-terror operation". As for Euronews they call people of Donbass "separatists" and it sounds fair. If Russia invaded Ukraina there would have been plenty of photo but all we see is irregular troops in Donetsk with no aviation amd lack of heavy weapons. For sure Kiev army has more men amd more weapons. As to me we see inner Ukrainian conflict though evry side gets help from its sponcors.
Why Kiev loses war now is because many sodiers on the battlefield see that population do not support them and they do not want to be punishers.
As for refujees from Donbass and Lugansk they are located through all Russia with official amount of 820.000 (!).It shows the scale of event. And it shows that people find shelter in Russia.
Lets come to past to show how all of it evolved taking Ukraina our of peace.
Yanukovich ( call him puppet President or not) was a legal president . He was elected legally. Moreover even now he is a legal president- his mandat is still legal. Though it means nothing- Constitution does not act.
Yanukovich meeting Barak and Michelle Obama.
After unrest in Kiev with hundreds dead policemen and manifestants, Yanukovich agreed to leave power legally.
American top officer Victoria Nuland ( Nudelman) takes part in the event in center of Kiev-
"February Kiev treaty" was signed on Feb 21 bu President Yanukovich and leaders of Ukrainian opposition and in presence of Mimesters of Foreing affairs of Poland, France and Germany.
According to this treaty Yanukovich was to take police out of centre of Kiev and to make new President elections. Opposition was to set all the state building free. Foreign ministers were to guarantee this treaty by their states.
If to note that all of this garants were Europen and non US. And US showed who leads the game and controls the opposition. The next day opposition broke the treaty and took all the central state buildings by storm. From this moment the situation became illegal. Perliament even made some anti-constitutional designations. President Yanukovich escaped to second biggest Ukrainian city of Harkov.
So now Ukraina has no acting Constitution. It has 2 Presidents. It has no legal Parliment.
New government cancelled some vital human rights and it was the reason of mass protest that we all se now. As I see , Europe tries to press breaks. But from other side of ocean power pushs gas. Russia tries to controll the situation in nearby regions habited by relative people but trying to minimise its risks.
As for situation for today, Kiev is preparing new autemn storm but in general it prepares the defence till spring.
Self-defence -
Kiev tropps on the move -
Kiev BTR burnt . The nets are used against RPG-
Self-defemce tank with signature "Tatiana" on a board-
Women of Donetsk with flag of self-defence-
What did that guy lost his leg for ?-
On the batlefield -
Kien panzer- armoured truck. mad Max came true.
The pic shoing how severe was artillery fire and fight near height of Saur Mogila ( Beast Grave)-
Prisonned punishers mrching in streets of Donetsk with strong guard -
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Post by pzoltan on Sept 4, 2014 10:36:04 GMT -5
Pzoltan, it's 2014 today, not 1400s My country had borders with Black sea in Middle-ages. So what I have to do? Scream: gimme back Belorus, Kaliningrad etc.? I see what you mean. Hungary was pretty big under the rule of King Luis the Great in the middle-ages, but obviously, this doesn't mean those lands are our property. What we are talking about is ethnicity. In a named region (or regions) Russians are absolute majority in the current Ukraine. If they state that they would like to join BACK to Russia - in a refferendum for instance - I belive they have every right to do it! See Scotland. The Scottish people DO have their right to be independent - as it's stated in several laws of the European Union - as well as the Catalan and Basque peoples. So what's wrong with that? By the way, thank you Stas for all the photos and explanations! Thank you for keeping me informed. Edit: I would like to add a little quote what I have just read, sorry if I translated it wrong: "What would the USA say if Canada and Mexico would want to join China's millitary alliance?" Said by John J. Mearsheimer, one of the most influential scientist of the USA, professor of the Chicago University. It's a part of a little article I'm reading. He says that the west provocated all this, and the USA needs to get over with this, leave them alone.
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Post by Stas on Sept 5, 2014 10:43:52 GMT -5
Today a ceasefire was signed by Kiev, Donetsk+Lugansk,and OSCE. Firstly this is not balanced one without US presence provided that OSCE do not play independently. But it sounds good by all means as any peace treaty. Hope this line will strengthen on .
For a coming storm in September Kiev prepared 16 batallions ( 5.000 men). Insanity rages on.
My friends from Kiev was shocked by "social ad" showen before a blockbuster in cinema - "help families of dead soldiers".
So cominf to new pics-
Local self-defence squad uses AC/DC tank On the gun of this tank signature says "hello" from its commander, a man from local Germans-
One of cirled batalion gunned down -
Trucks loaded with mines and bullets have detonated in part-
Curcles armors awfully destroyed-
BMP after a final panzerride-
Thats what they call "Anti-terror operation"-
Signature "Summer school Waterspring. I am the way, the truth and life."-
Another trophey of self-defence- self-moving gun "Acacia"-
Thats what should be an image of Acacia, flower not gun-
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Post by mika on Sept 5, 2014 13:41:39 GMT -5
That was maybe the shortest ceasefire in history. It was gone straight away.
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Post by Stas on Sept 8, 2014 2:58:36 GMT -5
Kylla, ceasfire led to deminished fire and stopped global activity though local episodes take place widely.
Both sides uses this time to fortify positions and to prepare for new battles. This war will end if-
1. Ukrainian people stop joining army and stop civil war 2. US and Russia come to formal or informal decision on the matter
Till now there is still a ideal hot-point - easy to influence on communication and business between Europe and Russia which is very profitable for other global players..
What is very good is that Ukranian people are more and more demanding to stop the war and to come to national dialogue -
Popular singer Ruslana ( winner of Eurovision 2004) appealed to stop a brother-killing war.Though she supported the war all this time. It would be lethal for her carrier some months ago but now its a trend-
Interesting pic- Ukrainian tank near big port city of Mariupol - it ramed the block and broke down . And the signature on this block is " Stop war" and it is in Ukrainian colors. BTW, the signature on the tank is - "to Moscow". Now its evident that the tank will not reach there. But it shows the gradus of war -
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Post by monstermanlt on Sept 10, 2014 0:07:52 GMT -5
Where is "official statement" and where are facts ? TV news said that one man died. Is it official news or fact? Media tells facts, but do I have to believe? In March one Russian Tv has show report about Ukrainian "terrorists" who learned all bad things in my country. TV reporter wanted to go in that house, but owner said him get out of here in TV camera. Is it fact that "terrorists" practiced in my country? Most of TV viewers probably think so. But Lithuanian TV reporters found that "terrorist's house" and asked owner about this situation. He remembered that few years ago there was some kind of company private party and when owner saw TV reporters he told them get out of here. Probably you all believed in first story. But one FACT. There was no snow in this March in Lithuania. TV report showed a lot of snow. Where is no war or invasion in Ukraine? Really? I wanted to show picture how Crimean people "chose" how to vote i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02850/crimea-referendum_2850933b.jpg
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Post by Stas on Sept 10, 2014 2:33:47 GMT -5
Ok, as to me I think that we are not to believe news immediately. Its better to check the info.
I put Your pic here to have it visible ( the signature is "OR" )-
Pic is visual agitaion but people are clever enough to agree or to desagree as they have free will. One of my closest friend was born in Krim , his parents live there and he just came back from his vacations there. He answered me that the situation was always definite- people wanted to be with Russia all the time. But noone asked their will.
You see in this screenshot how Kiev Primier-minister Yatsenuk called people who oppose him now in Donetsk and Lugansk- "subhumans"-
He got his power illegally . How can he appeal to illegal war calling millions of people "subhumans"?
It is beyond the reason Past point of no return
If people are not slaves and not subhumans there are for sure have the Constitutional rights. If the Constitutuons is broken country is to come back to it . But the only talk now is to fight on. So there is nothing strange that people fight back more and more.
As for todays situation, full scale activity is to continue in a few days. Kiev has about 60.000 troops and 1.000 armors. Aviation is about zero. People^s Republics have about 25.000 troops and about 200 armors. Of cause its not modern armies but just all they can get at the moment.
Kiev will storm cities for September and October till the end of this bloody autemn.
New pics-
Saur Mogila ( Beast Grave) ruined while desparate fire. This is the biggest height in Donetsk region so it controlles big territory.
They call it panzer-
Modernised Kiev^s T-64 on the move in Harkov-
One of the squads of People^s Republics-
Graves of their comrades-
Self-defence on move-
Everyday picture-
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Post by monstermanlt on Sept 15, 2014 11:19:40 GMT -5
Pkzoltan, I'm sure that referendums in Scotland and Catalonia will ends without blood and without invasion of troopers from foreign countires. Stas, as Einstein once told: "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity." So I think that media, posters "choose Nazis or Russia" have big influence on people. That's very sad. By the way : do you really believe that 96.77 percent people in Crimea voted for integration of the region into the Russian Federation ? Almost all countries have problems with minorities. But I think, that if your nationality is not the same as country where you live, you have to respect it's law, borders and customs.
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Post by Stas on Sept 15, 2014 15:08:38 GMT -5
Well, Monsterman, let me disagree with You - I think that people are not stupid. No matter who are they. They choose by their own. If they are not zombie.
As for Krim vote , the official data is - 96,77 % voted to join Russia, 83,1% participators . So formally amount of voters for Russia is 97,77%83%=80% approximately.
The difference between Krim and other former Ukrainian regions is that Sevastopol have always been the fleet base and to provide the security thousands of veterans traditionally were settled there with the families.
One more moment- there were 20.000 troops in Ukrainian army in Krim mostly locals. So without any shot 18.000 joined Russia and stayed in Krim . 2.000 left Krim peacefully .
If soldiers with their weapons join Russia by thousands-it is their free will. For instance, a very interesting person, Margarita Seidler from Germany ( I will give some info about her later) said that Russian spirit was especially strong in Krim, she felt it.
If Donetck and Lugansk have 7 mln population only police is several tens of thousands. It is impossible to control such territories without support of population.
But the situation differs on other regions , I see it.
As for today's situation, many troops are in their positions but the scale is much less now. Everyday losses by all means are about dozen from each side.
like Let me quote one guy -
"But I think, that if your nationality is not the same as country where you live, you have to respect it's law, borders and customs"- Right You are, man. Law is Constitution.No Constitution- no Law. There is no Constitution in Ukraina since Feb 22. They try to debate about a new one but time is now right for sure.
So coming to Frau Seidler.
As You watch Russian TV, I think that You speak Russian-
yandex.ru/video/search?text=%D0%BC%D0%B0%D1%80%D0%B3%D0%B0%D1%80%D0%B8%D1%82%D0%B0+%D0%B7%D0%B0%D0%B9%D0%B4%D0%BB%D0%B5%D1%80+%D1%84%D0%BE%D1%82%D0%BE
This woman has an interesting and outstanding life realy showing that soul is higher than body. She was born in Germany and tried to find the ultimate road. She tried extreme sport and it was not the item. She tried church as its possible to visit nearby kirchen of Lutherans, Catholics and Orthodox in Germany. She felt a touch in Ortodox church. What I found really great that that Ortodox community rented a Catholic temple for rites- this shows really good relation between communities. So Ortodoxes told her that she had better stay Catholic cause its hard for her to understand prayers.But Margarita went on. After sometime she realised that it is not enough for her to live in socium and she wanted to come to monastery. She said that even Orthodox Church in Germany became too social.
She was blessed to leave "Eurosodom" and went to Kiev. Some time passed and God gave her opportunity to see the revolt by her own eyes- she saw the rebellion. Step by step.From nazi graffity to burning city and hundreds of deads in the streets. She left to Krim and than to Donbass. She said that both of her Oppas , Granddads had no chance to choose their side. But she has now.
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